Ken+ and Mark+ I'm not sure the Arius v. Athanasius analogy is as close as is the Catholic v. Donatist controversy of the 4th century. The simple reason is that like us, ECUSA still recites the historic creedal formulas (as did the Catholics and the Donatists), while the Arians did not. While the Catholics and Donatists argued over the issue of the purity of the Church, the Arians proposed a completely different religion -- something that ECUSA has not formally done. MLW+