Charles+ I believe you've hit the nail on the head when you said that there will be few orthodox left in TEC to even attempt any last-minute efforts to stem the tide. That's always the problem when there is mass migration out of a church that's lost her moorings: there's no one left to return her to her course. TEC is now a classic example. The sad thing is that there is no unified orthodox front either. The alphabet soup of continuing/schismatic/whatever-you-want-to-call-it groups simply continues to multiply and, aside from a few efforts like FACA to try to bring them back together, few of them want to seriously sit down at an intra-mural ecumenical table to try to knit themselves (ourselves?) into one cohesive orthodox whole. The best we've been able to do is forge alliances while maintaining our independent provinces. If that's as good as it's ever going to get, what are we going to pass to the next generation? ... assuming there's anything to pass. MLW+ ================== Five years ago, some of our brothers wondered aloud whether it was better for the orthodox to stay in TEC and work for reform or to come out and build anew. That was before the Titanic entered its final plunge into the depths. Now it appears there will be few conservatives remaining to sing "Nearer my God to Thee."