i'm sure that i saw this one here recently, that is, how to use a ppat background on an EF. can someone point me in the right direction? tia, :-j now i will answer my own mail... i hacked this direct from PG [call once you create you window]: '------- start code ----------- clear local mode local fn setBackPPat( pPatID as int) dim @ ppat&,thePort&,oldPixPat& ppat& = FN GETPIXPAT( pPatID) LONG IF ppat& GETPORT(thePort&) oldPixPat& = [thePort& + _bkPat] LONG IF oldPixPat& DISPOSPIXPAT(oldPixPat&) END IF BACKPIXPAT(ppat&) END IF end fn '------- end code ------------- unfortunately [well for me, for you things are probably fine] the border of wodgets [i should have said widgets, but i made a typo, and rather liked the result, anyway back to the point] appear in white [widgets/wodgets btw are the toolbox buttons, fields and so on that we put in a window]. now i suppose that not many people have bathed in these waters [through choice, not ignorance, quite the opposite in fact, i'm sure you're all too bright to want to do this in the first place], but would anyone have even the vaguest idea of how to get this to appear normal [ie, no white borders on widgets in case i lost you on the way]. my personal little pinky itches in two directions: - pen parametres - tansfer mode. but my ignorance prevents me from going further down this boulevard. all help appreciated, again tia :-j