Jerry k... are you going to the same heaven as sheildwolf???? that would mean you are trusting sacraments too....?? now I am cornfused.....help......help.......I need someone HELLLLLLLLLLPPPP.......HELPPPPPPPPPPP ME THE ONLY REASON SOMEONE WOULD THINK A PERSON IS GOING TO HELL IS BECAUSE THEY WOULD OF BEEN LED TO BELIEVE THAT THE PERSON IS TRUSTING IN SOMETHING OTHER THAN THE FINISHED WORK OF JESUS CHRIST ON THE CROSS FOR SALVATION NO WORKS NO SACRAMENTS NO BAPTISM NO SPEAKING IN TONGUES NO COMMUNION NO DEMONINATION NO CREED NO CHURCH (YES DR DAVE..NOT EVEN IFB) JUST JOHN 14:6 JERRY ....I AINT GONNA SEE ANYONE IN HEAVEN THAT IS TRUSTING THE ABOVE FOR SALVATION....SO IF YOU ARE YOU MUST BE GOING TO A DIFF HEAVEN THAN ME IS.... SO IF YOU ADD TO OR TAKE AWAY FROM THE BIBICAL PLAN OF SALVATION IN ANY WAY SHAPE OR FORM .....SOMEONE MIGHT THINK THAT YOU OR WHOEVER IS HEADED STRAIGHT FOR A DEVILS HELL......THAT IS IF THEY KNEW WHAT BIBLE SALVATION REALLY WAS ????? AND THAT THEY KNEW HOW TO GET IT! NOW IT IS KINDA OF A SHAME THAT I HAD TO SPELL THIS OUT THIS WAY IN THIS FORUM DO WE NEED TO GO BACK TO SALVATION 101? ELEMENTARY MY DEAR WATSON ELEMENTARY....... this is the day that the Lord hath made I will be glad and rejoice in it..... acts 4:12 no other name kUMBYA.....KUMBYAAAAAA OH MY KUMBYAAAAAAAAAAAAAA SOMEONES LOST LORD.... KUMBYAAAAAAAAAAA SOMEONES LOST LORD KUMBYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA this is wild stuff...... SOME BODY NEEDS TO QUIT KICKIN AGAINST THE PRICKS...... Pastor Hughes www.eastmesabaptist.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Warner" <dwarner@...> To: <pastorsforum@...> Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 10:04 AM Subject: RE: [PastorsForum] Re: [DoctrinalDebate] Re: Signs and Gifts > What, exactly, is that "popular beliefs" and who believes them? > > PDW > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Jerry Krewson [mailto:pastorjerry@...] > Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 2:28 AM > To: pastorsforum@... > Subject: Re: [PastorsForum] Re: [DoctrinalDebate] Re: Signs and Gifts > > Randy, > Contray to SOME popular beliefs, I look forward to meeting you in heaven. > jerry k > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <shieldwolf@...> > To: <pastorsforum@...> > Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 7:04 PM > Subject: Re: [PastorsForum] Re: [DoctrinalDebate] Re: Signs and Gifts > > >> Don't worry, Jerry. I'm sure they think I'm going to Hell. I think >> that >> goes back to the whole "stigma" discussion which seems to support the >> whole "legalism" discussion that was had. >> >> Randy >> >> >>> PDW, >>> If you wish to characterize me as that, I can handle that. I have been >>> accused of worse. >>> MAKE IT a great weekend. >>> jerry k >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: David Warner >>> To: pastorsforum@... >>> Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 12:39 PM >>> Subject: RE: [PastorsForum] Re: [DoctrinalDebate] Re: Signs and Gifts >>> >>> >>> Well you are just full of profanity today, aren't you! >>> >>> A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good >>> things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil >>> things. But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, >>> they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment. For by thy words >>> thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned. >>> >>> (Matthew 12:35-37) >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- >>> >>> From: Jerry Krewson [mailto:pastorjerry@...] >>> Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 3:05 PM >>> To: pastorsforum@... >>> Subject: Re: [PastorsForum] Re: [DoctrinalDebate] Re: Signs and Gifts >>> >>> >>> >>> Heck if I know! >>> >>> jerry k >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>> From: David Warner >>> >>> To: pastorsforum@... >>> >>> Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 8:27 AM >>> >>> Subject: RE: [PastorsForum] Re: [DoctrinalDebate] Re: Signs and >>> Gifts >>> >>> >>> >>> Isn't "Darn" an euphemism for "Damn"? I've always thought it was? >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> From: Jerry Krewson [mailto:pastorjerry@...] >>> Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 12:20 PM >>> To: pastorsforum@... >>> Subject: Re: [PastorsForum] Re: [DoctrinalDebate] Re: Signs and >>> Gifts >>> >>> >>> >>> When a believer is filled with the Holy Spirit, he can speak in >>> tongues anywhere. >>> >>> Darn, all this time I thought I was filled with the Holy Spirit? >>> >>> jerry k >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>> From: Jerry >>> >>> To: pastorsforum@... >>> >>> Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 6:13 AM >>> >>> Subject: Re: [PastorsForum] Re: [DoctrinalDebate] Re: Signs and >>> Gifts >>> >>> >>> >>> Jimbo, >>> >>> >>> >>> The church that I currently pastor would not be termed a >>> "Charismatic church." We have not had anyone speak in tongues >>> publicly in any services in the short time I have been here, that I >>> am aware of. >>> >>> >>> >>> However, we do often have special prayer with laying on of hands >>> for >>> the sick at their request according to James 5:14-16. >>> >>> >>> >>> I have been in many services in the past where all spiritual gifts >>> were in operation. There are no "circumstances" that trigger >>> tongues-speaking in a service. >>> >>> >>> >>> When a believer is filled with the Holy Spirit, he can speak in >>> tongues anywhere. Paul's instruction in the letter to the >>> Corinthians is to not practice it in the church service UNLESS there >>> is the interpretation to accompany it, the reason being, speaking in >>> tongues edifies and spiritually builds up the one doing the speaking >>> and not the entire church (1 Cor. 14:2-6, 18-19). Prophecy edifies >>> and spiritually builds up the entire church, so it is the preferred >>> gift in the church service. >>> >>> >>> >>> Paul stated that he spoke in tongues more than all of the church >>> at >>> Corinth, so he obviously engaged in a great deal of tongues-speaking >>> in his private devotions because he said that "in the church" it is >>> better to use words with which to teach others (1 Cor. 14:18-19). >>> >>> >>> >>> That reiterates the simple truth that speaking in tongues IS NOT A >>> PREACHING OR TEACHING GIFT. It is a provision for the Spirit-filled >>> believer to build himself up in the Lord spiritually, what the Bible >>> terms "edification." >>> >>> >>> >>> 1 Cor. 14:2 states that the one who is speaking in tongues IS NOT >>> SPEAKING UNTO MEN, BUT UNTO GOD, and that NO MAN understands HIM. >>> "Speaking unto God" is what most people term "PRAYER." Therefore, >>> speaking in tongues is a supernatural means of praying. This fits 1 >>> Cor. 14:14-15 where Paul wrote that when he prayed with tongues his >>> spirit was praying. >>> >>> >>> >>> When the spiritual gifts of "divers kinds of tongues" and >>> "interpretation of tongues" are in operation, it is at the prompting >>> of the Holy Spirit, not "circumstances." >>> >>> >>> >>> According to 1 Cor 14:3-5, prophecy (as well as "divers kinds of >>> tongues" with the companion gift of "interpretation of tongues") >>> serves to edify (spiritually build up), comfort, and exhort >>> (encourage) the saints. >>> >>> >>> >>> I have witnessed only one negative incident. In an AOG church my >>> wife and I attended a few times about 30 years ago, a woman would >>> stand and speak in tongues and disturb the service. The pastor >>> tried to correct her and instruct her that it was not an appropriate >>> time. She refused correction and the deacons ushered her out. >>> >>> >>> >>> When these gifts are in operation according to the instructions >>> given in 1 Cor 12-14, they are a great blessing. They bring sweet >>> refreshing and encouragement unto people. But they can also be >>> abused and misused. >>> >>> >>> >>> Speaking in tongues has been a tremendous blessing in my own life. >>> It has enriched my life greatly. >>> >>> >>> >>> Jerry >>> >>> "Therefore they stayed there a long time, speaking boldly in the >>> Lord, who was bearing witness to the word of His grace, granting >>> signs and wonders to be done by their hands" (Acts 14:3). >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>> From: J & M >>> >>> To: pastorsforum@... >>> >>> Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 6:46 AM >>> >>> Subject: Re: [PastorsForum] Re: [DoctrinalDebate] Re: Signs and >>> Gifts >>> >>> >>> >>> Jerry, >>> >>> >>> >>> How often and in what way does tongues speaking occur in your >>> services? >>> >>> >>> >>> Which services does it usually happen in and what are the >>> circumstances which trigger it? >>> >>> >>> >>> How has it been a value? >>> >>> >>> >>> Others please answer as well. As a non-tongues speaker with >>> very >>> limited experience observing it in a service (and the experiences >>> were negative) , I'd like to hear your experience. >>> >>> >>> >>> Thanks >>> >>> Jimbo >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>> From: Jerry >>> >>> To: pastorsforum@... >>> >>> Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 12:26 AM >>> >>> Subject: Re: [PastorsForum] Re: [DoctrinalDebate] Re: Signs >>> and >>> Gifts >>> >>> >>> >>> DW, >>> >>> >>> >>> Scripture is fact, absolute fact. >>> >>> >>> >>> But there is no Scripture that states signs and wonders >>> stopped >>> when the last apostle died. That is vain imagination. >>> >>> >>> >>> And the preacher who declared that it was absolute fact that >>> signs and wonders ceased when the last apostle died lied. >>> >>> >>> >>> Jerry >>> >>> "Therefore they stayed there a long time, speaking boldly in >>> the >>> Lord, who was bearing witness to the word of His grace, granting >>> signs and wonders to be done by their hands" (Acts 14:3). >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>> From: David Warner >>> >>> To: pastorsforum@... >>> >>> Sent: Friday, May 30, 2008 11:41 PM >>> >>> Subject: RE: [PastorsForum] Re: [DoctrinalDebate] Re: Signs >>> and Gifts >>> >>> >>> >>> He is correct from your perspective. That doesn't make it >>> truth, even if validated by your "amen". >>> >>> I'd say Scripture is pretty "absolute fact" regardless of >>> whether everyone sees the fact or not, wouldn't you? >>> >>> PDW >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> From: Jerry [mailto:jlew@...] >>> Sent: Friday, May 30, 2008 10:22 PM >>> To: pastorsforum@... >>> Subject: Re: [PastorsForum] Re: [DoctrinalDebate] Re: Signs >>> and Gifts >>> >>> >>> >>> Bill, >>> >>> >>> >>> You are 100% correct. >>> >>> >>> >>> Amazing, though, some IFB claim that this is an "absolute >>> fact." >>> >>> >>> >>> Jerry >>> >>> "Therefore they stayed there a long time, speaking boldly in >>> the Lord, who was bearing witness to the word of His grace, >>> granting signs and wonders to be done by their hands" (Acts >>> 14:3). >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>> From: Bill burns >>> >>> To: pastorsforum@... >>> >>> Sent: Friday, May 30, 2008 2:30 PM >>> >>> Subject: Re: [PastorsForum] Re: [DoctrinalDebate] Re: >>> Signs >>> and Gifts >>> >>> >>> >>> Those who don't believe in the signs and gifts need to >>> show >>> Biblically when they ceased. There is no where in the Bible >>> that states the signs and gifts stopped with the Apostles. >>> >>> >>> >>> Bill >>> >>> Jeff Hallmark <bctexan@...> wrote: >>> >>> In studying Hebrews 2:1-4 I read this from W. Wiersbe, >>> Be >>> Confident his study of Hebrews. >>> >>> >>> >>> Wiersbe writes - >>> >>> I have often told the story about the pastor who >>> preached >>> a series of sermons on "the sins of the saints." He was >>> severely reprimanded by one of the members of the church. >>> "After all," said the member, "sin in the life of a >>> Christian is different from sin in the lives of other >>> people." >>> >>> >>> >>> "Yes," replied the pastor "it's worse!" >>> >>> >>> >>> We have the idea that believers today "under grace" can >>> escape the chastening hand of God that was so evident >>> "under Law." But to whom much is given, much shall be >>> required. Not only have we received the Word from the Son >>> of God, but that Word has been confirmed by apostolic >>> miracles (2:4). The phrase "signs and wonders" is found 11 >>> times in the NT. Here it refers to the miracles that >>> witnessed to the Word and gave confirmation that it was >>> true. These miracles were performed by the apostles. (see >>> Mark 16:17-20; Acts 2:43). Today we have the completed >>> Word of God; so there is no need for these apostolic >>> miracles. God now bears witness through His Spirit using >>> the Word (Rom. 8:16; 1 John 5:1-13). The Spirit also gifts >>> to God's people so that they may minister in the church >>> (Eph. 4:11; 1 Cor. 12) >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Bro. Jeff Hallmark >>> www.sprucelandbaptist.com >>> http://baptist-potluck.blogspot.com/ >>> >>> To subscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-join@... To >>> unsubscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... >>> >>> >>> >>> Bill Burns >>> Old Town Soup Kitchen >>> 600 Gratiot St. >>> Saginaw, Michigan 48602 >>> >>> 989.791.4549 or cell 989.220.6228 >>> >>> >>> >>> To subscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-join@... To >>> unsubscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... >>> >>> >>> >>> To subscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-join@... To >>> unsubscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... >>> >>> >>> >>> To subscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-join@... To >>> unsubscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... >>> >>> >>> >>> To subscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-join@... To >>> unsubscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... >>> >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> >>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>> Checked by AVG. >>> Version: 8.0.100 / Virus Database: 269.24.4/1475 - Release >>> Date: >>> 5/30/2008 2:53 PM >>> >>> >>> >>> To subscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-join@... To >>> unsubscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... >>> >>> >>> >>> To subscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-join@... To >>> unsubscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... >>> >>> >>> >>> To subscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-join@... To >>> unsubscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... >>> >>> >>> >>> To subscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-join@... To >>> unsubscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... >>> >>> >>> >>> To subscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-join@... To >>> unsubscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... >>> >>> >>> >>> To subscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-join@... >>> >>> To unsubs >>> cribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> To subscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-join@... >>> >>> To unsubscribe, send a message to: >>> pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... >>> >>> >> >> To subscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-join@... >> >> To unsubscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... >> >> > > To subscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-join@... > > To unsubscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... > > To subscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-join@... > > To unsubscribe, send a message to: pastorsforum-unsubscribe@... > >