Jeff wrote, "Of course everyone tries to reduce the issues to taste, which is a nice way of avoiding the issue. The fact is that the contemporary 'Christian' songs that are sung in our church are grossly repetitive and one frequently wonders what the lyrics mean anyway. There is one that we sing that continually repeats the words 'there is none like you' and in the midst of that repetition we have the words 'suffering children are safe in your hands' , the relevance of which to any overall theme of the song completely escapes me." The term "contemporary Christian" sounds is a label that is widely use for various types of music, such as; "Stryper" a heavy metal band or the likes of Army Grant who sings "pop" music which is mellower than heavy metal music but still rock nevertheless. Because "contemporary" so-called Christian music copies the various levels of rock, blues, and even more forms of music, it tends to be very repetitive. The words in my opinion are more shallow than a traditional hymn. A traditional hymn sung in this style tends not to be sing in great relevance...as Jeff pointed out.... On 8/21/06, Neil Whitcombe <neil.whitcombe@...> wrote: > > > > > Jeff > > > > Most of what you have said could be applied to old hymns as well. Don't > forget that in your hymn book you only have the "good" ones. You need to > look out for the new hymns by Stuart Townsend and Graham Kendrick to mention > just two! It sounds very much like folk believing in the inspiration of the > hymn book to me unwilling to change and being content to live in a by gone > era trapped in a time warp singing words that are archaic and lacking > meaning to most modern folk (I'm not referring to theology) – watch out if > you dare change them or want to sing hymns other than from the only > "inspired era". There is some great theology in modern hymns we cannot tar > everyone with the same brush. > > It is hymns we are talking about or is it Bible translations J > > > > Neil > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Jeff Scanlan [mailto:jscanlan@...] > Sent: 21 August 2006 12:33 > To: soundofgrace@... > Subject: RE: [soundofgrace] music > > > > > > I don't know, Moe, what contemporary singing music you experienced or what > you might ever define as contemporary but around here it leaves a lot to be > desired. > > > > Of course everyone tries to reduce the issues to taste, which is a nice way > of avoiding the issue. The fact is that the contemporary 'Christian' songs > that are sung in our church are grossly repetitive and one frequently > wonders what the lyrics mean anyway. There is one that we sing that > continually repeats the words 'there is none like you' and in the midst of > that repetition we have the words 'suffering children are safe in your > hands' , the relevance of which to any overall theme of the song completely > escapes me. > > > > And then there is the song that repeatedly has the words 'Ancient of Days' > and I keep wondering as to how many in the congregation have the slightest > concept of what that term signifies. > > > > You see I happen to believe that if a church is serious about its theology, > which we all here surely would agree is needed, then there will be a linking > of the music with the messages as they are faithfully proclaimed. That in my > neck of the woods is just not happening. The singing is just a heap of 'God > words' that IMHO give one the false sense that they are really being > worshipful. > > > > Okay I know that the same could be said of the mindless singing of the old > style hymns and I would agree. But at least in those hymns there is > generally a development of a theological theme. For instance, in 'How Great > Thou Art' there is a progression from what one might call 'natural > revelation' to divine revelation in Jesus Christ to looking forward to His > glorious return. How many contemporary songs are structured like that? > > > > Oh yes there is one that I am aware of and that is 'How deep the Father's > love for us'! > > > > Finally let me say that it is also my experience that copious singing of > contemporary Christian songs is really a substitute for good theological > thought and I daily live with the results in my very own family. > > > > God bless, > > Jeff > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > From: Moe Bergeron [mailto:moebergeron@...] > Sent: Monday, 21 August 2006 7:49 AM > To: soundofgrace@... > Subject: Re: [soundofgrace] music > > > > Boss, > > I spent two and a half years in a Sovereign Grace Ministries church > (charismatic/doctrine of grace churches) and loved to sing with them. Never, > ever, did I believe their contemporary singing on the whole, was less > thoughtful or less God honoring than the Ira Sankey and Fanny Crosby hymns I > was brought up on as a young Christian. I will sing either way provided our > Lord's name is lifted high. > > Moe > > > > > On 8/20/06, John Reisinger <jreisinger24@...> wrote: > > > > > Moe: I would love to see a service where a Psalms-singing only church with > a no instrument choir, "literally" practice what Psalm 150 instucts should > be done in worship.. Just imagine the following: > > > > > > The Choir sings verse2 1 Praise ye the LORD. Praise God in his sanctuary: > praise him in the firmament of his power. > 2 Praise him for his mighty acts: praise him according to his excellent > greatness. And the whole congregation, obeying the text, shouts "praise the > Lord." > > > The choir sings verse 3 Praise him with the sound of the trumpet: praise him > with the psaltery and harp, and some trumpets blare and harps play as the > text encourages. > > > The choir sings verse 4 Praise him with the timbrel and dance: praise him > with stringed instruments and organs, and some young men and women, as > instructed in the text, dance across the stage shaking timbrels while > guitars and fiddles play. > The choir sings verse 5 Praise him upon the loud cymbals: praise him upon > the high sounding cymbals. And the cymbals sound and the "high sounding > cymbals" (the really big ones) crash. > The choir concludes in verse 6 Let every thing that hath breath praise the > LORD. Praise ye the LORD, and again the entire congregation obeys the > Psalmist words and shouts, "Priase the Lord." > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: Moe Bergeron > > > To: soundofgrace@... > > > > Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2006 7:01 AM > > > Subject: Re: [soundofgrace] music > > > > > > Brethren, > > NT practice may be of help now and then but I have yet to meet the preacher > who leaves his bag of money home when he goes out to proclaim the kingdom. > My point? WWJD works only so far. Common sense has to prevail or we will > chuck out our pews, pulpits, choirs, english translations, orartory and who > knows what else? (Bruce, Please resist the temptation.) > > I chuckle when our reformed brethren, who are normally always running to > the law to set boundaries for others, end up using the NT to establish rules > for singing. Something if off key. Personaly, as a card carrying NCT guy, I > appeal to Psalm 150 with the hope of raising the dead while we praise God > who has granted us liberty. > > 1 Praise ye the LORD. Praise God in his sanctuary: praise him in the > firmament of his power. > 2 Praise him for his mighty acts: praise him according to his excellent > greatness. > 3 Praise him with the sound of the trumpet: praise him with the psaltery > and harp. > 4 Praise him with the timbrel and dance: praise him with stringed > instruments and organs. > 5 Praise him upon the loud cymbals: praise him upon the high sounding > cymbals. > 6 Let every thing that hath breath praise the LORD. Praise ye the LORD. > > I know I haven't said it yet so here it is.... welcome to the list! > > Moe > > > On 8/20/06, Wallstreet < compadvisor@... > wrote: > > > Let's put in another way, no example of NT believers practicing instrumental > music doesn't endorse the idea that it's alright for Christians to practice > instrumental music in the NT...The apostles were taught by Christ in person, > and it's best to follow their example rather than endorse an idea which has > no example at all in Scriptures... > > Mike > > > > > > > > > > > -- Read the Sound of Grace pages at http://www.soundofgrace.com To unsubsc > ribe, send ANY message to: > soundofgrace-unsubscribe@... To view o ur online > archive go to our web page at > http://www.associate.com/groups/soun dofgrace > > > > > > > > -- > ___________________________________________ > Isaiah 42:6, 49:8 > > = > -- > Read the Sound of Grace pages at > http://www.soundofgrace.com > > To unsubsc= > ribe, send ANY message to: > soundofgrace-unsubscribe@... > > To view o= > ur online archive go to our web page at > http://www.associate.com/groups/soun= > dofgrace > > > > > > > > = > -- > Read the Sound of Grace pages at > > http://www.soundofgrace.com To unsubsc ribe, send ANY message to: > soundofgrace-unsubscribe@... To view o ur online > archive go to our web page at > http://www.associate.com/groups/soun dofgrace > >